It used to be me.
I was the one who sat at my Madison Avenue desk (whch was rarely anywhere near Madison Avenue, truth be told) and thought, “how do we talk to moms?”
I was the one who sat in the dark behind the two-way mirror in focus groups rolling my eyes at the housewives on the other side.
I was the one who thought that moms were women with children first.
Last.
Only.
I could march for women’s rights and write papers on feminism, and read Ms. Magazine all I wanted but while the women I admired I knew may have also been moms–I didn’t think of “moms” and conjure up women I admired.
Mostly I thought of carpools.
It’s an easy group to dismiss, I suppose. Because when marketers talk to moms they think of us in terms of that which we consume: Dish detergent. Hamburger helper. Tile cleanser. Minivans with cupholders and built-in DVDs. And why not? The vast majority are not interested in our hopes and dreams and mental well-being, so much as these things are a conduit for selling stuff.
It’s why, in part, I’m so defensive of us. It’s my own mea culpa. It’s my own attempt to make up for misguided beliefs. that were in part informed by a very narrow peer group sharing a very narrow lifestyle. Kids? Those are for 40-somethings in Westchester.
Last week’s AdAge editorial on mommybloggers and swag has stuck in my craw, and not because of the points in it itself, or because the writer omitted a fact that changed the tone of the piece.
But because of the nature of the comment thread.
The men in the thread (with very few exceptions) didn’t comment on the piece. They didn’t shed light on the discussion. What they did was attack the commenters. Because we are moms. And therefore we must be fucking idiots.
The comment that got me the most came from someone I may have even met before. I may have had a glass of Pinot with him at an award show or made idle chithat at an industry loft party on New Year’s Eve. We probably engaged in the proverbial Showing of the Dicks advertising ritual and decided that based on who we knew in common and where we’d worked and what awards we’d won and what clever little spontaneous quips we could toss out on cue, that we could be seen talking together.
Maybe we even liked each other.
In the comments of the AdAge article, he wrote:
I still haven’t been able to find any mommies I know who read these blogs.They’re all too busy, it seems, trying to keep Junior from exploring the wall sockets with the cat’s tail.
And all at once he marginalizes motherhood, he demeans those who choose to write (perhaps radically?) about the important business of motherhood, and he insinuates pretty plainly that us “mommies” who blog reeeeally should get a life and leave the writing to the professionals.
(Of course he also uses the really trite and dated “Junior” as generic stand-in for “child,” even while everyone knows by now that it’s far funnier to write “Little Madysynne Kayleigh.”)
Do you know what the great irony is?
This is someone who has earned his living (and his awards) from writing ads about Campbell’s Soup.
For mothers.
Us.
I know what happens when a marketing professional insults his client. But what happens when he insults his audience?
Let me say here that I’m not writing this to create a pile-on situation in comments where everyone finds a new and more clever way to express what a douche he is. (Which I know you could all totally do and rather well, I might add.) He may be. He also may be the nicest guy you’ve ever met; maybe he’s even a dad himself. And if we do attack him, we’re doing just what he did to us – creating a charicature based on a few sentences.
I’m writing this because the comment is emblematic of how very, very damaged the the marketing and advertising industry can be in how it looks at moms. So damaged, that a professional can leave a disparaging comment on a very public trade publication website, and not anonymously either. Why be anonymous? He was proud of his comment! It was funny! C’mon guys, lighten up! I love moms! Some of my best friends are moms!
Maybe you don’t care what other people think of you, but I do. I always have and it’s my own cross to bear. And it pisses me off to no end.
I’m also writing this because I think it’s exquisitely emblematic of why I keep ranting about how we have to be better (and probably better than we should have to be). More thoughtful. More professional. More aware. And certainly less easily dismissed.
I know. I’ve been on the other side.
90 shards of brilliance… read them below or add one
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Amen! I just raged this morning about professionalism in this arena. It goes both ways…if we, as bloggers, want to treated professionally, we have to act professionally. And if PR wants professionals to blog for them, they need to treat us as such.
Those who dismiss mothers, do it at their peril.
I'm assuming this gentleman was being interviewed from the 80s?
Moms of the blog, unite. You have nothing to lose but your chains. Don't let someone else tell you what conversation you are having, should be having, or shouldn't be allowed into.
Gargahagah! I'm not sure if I'm coherent enough to say anything beyond that.
This disconnect and disrespect makes me sad and angry. Tell us what he's selling. I'll be sure not to buy it.
-Christine
Couldn't have said it better myself. PR professionals need to realize that we are professionals and as Tiffany had mentioned, need to be treated as such! We are moms, but there is SO much more to who we are than just the fruit of our loins!
Nothing to say here except, you GO.
Well said. Necessary to cut through all the generalizations and stereotypes people make thinking they are making a great point, instead they only point out their inability to look at what is really happening.
You are absolutely correct.
I haven't gone back to the comment thread at AdAge since Friday, but what I found were the those who were defending Lindsey by pointing out the author's lack of professionalism and the others just attacking those commenters for their comments implying that they were not justified (which they were) and making broad sterotyping statements about the mom blogging community.
Honestly I ignored the latter because it oozed of the sexism you describe here and like any troll doesn't deserve my attention.
But that's why I love you. You take it head on!
As a side note– Ultimately, AdAge corrected the misuse of the quote because they were plain 'ol wrong.
been on both sides too…and it's harder being a SAHM for sure, in my case at least. i do get upset when i'm dismissed, with all the education and knowledge and…well, let's be honest. the stuff i do every day really matters in the end bc my kids are not only the future, but the present. mr marketing, don't dismiss me…i may just have more education than you and i def have more time in the trenches than you so BACK OFF and listen to my friend here.
you go girl.
Nothing brilliant to say (too early, too little coffee), but as someone also walking both sides of the line, I just have to say, amen, sister.
Most of my clients are targeting women, age 35 and up, but still have no idea to talk to them.
I worked in digital media/advertising until I started working from home last year. The men I worked with didn't exactly set the bar for classiness or professionalism.
Many of them frequented message boards like 4Chan and played around on Digg. And the comments were pretty much the polar opposite of appropriate.
But I drive two kids around in the back of my car, so I'm held to higher standards about how I behave on the Internet?
It makes me furious.
And thank you, thank you, thank you.
I'm not trying to be a professional blogger, I prefer being able to be casual in my blog. I think a lot of bloggers write for other reasons than a career. If I wanted to get paid, I'd go back to being a designer.
Great post, Liz.
Interestingly, I do not like being called a “mom” or a “mommy”. I prefer to be called a “mother” by outside folks and “mama” by my own children.
I suspect it is because the words “mom” and “mommy” have been misused and spoken in such sneering, sarcastic tones for years that those two words have been ruined for me. Possibly forever.
The attitude that marketing takes towards us is just small glimpse into a problem at large.
I'm STILL on the other side. And my opinions are often dismissed. And it's crazy. Because I'm a mom who works in the advertising industry and has been part of the social media “stratosphere” for well over five years, I'm the person they desperately want to market to, yet my opinions about ideas, tactics, etc., are easily and often dismissed. Ironic to say the least. To say I feel “mommy tracked” is an understatement, and in the industry I'm in, it's ridonkulous that they do it.
Liz, as always, brilliant and fierce. Sadly, I've seen the contempt for moms Liz is talking about firsthand. I even heard a colleague say once in mock frustration during a brainstorm, “When can we stop talking about mom, already…that bitch.” Well, “that bitch” is the purchase gatekeeper for nearly all U.S. households so this contempt from some of our marketing brethren is obviously infected with resentement and dare I say fear? Fear that if they can't figure out how to talk to this enormously powerful purchasing community, their own job performance is at stake? That said, I also have dozens of marketing clients — male — who have great respect for the enormous influence of mothers as consumers and dedicate their careers to better understanding her habits and needs. They're not all bad guys but sadly, the bad guys tend to be the mouthy ones who spew their negativity and disregard with abandon. (P.S. quick note to other commenters: the douchery in question came from an ad guy, not a PR person. Just saying.)
Tela, yes I'm still on the other side too. Although I'm not on the side that rolls my eyes any more. (Except sometimes, with love. Heh.)
And YES Stephanie, this was an ad guy, not a PR guy. I know far more about the habits and rituals of ad guys. Although I'd imagine they all share a lot of the same DNA.
Just another reason I continue to be the official
“Liz GummyBear FanGirl”
Love ya, Lady!
You! You are the awesome. I love your ferocity, and you are spot on, 100%.
When you described the part about looking through the windows at the research groups? SO THERE. I worked on a popular diaper brand for years as a 20something. Now? *NOW* I don't. Doesn't make sense. And I still roll my eyes, too mostly at the brand re: the target audience description. Women! Don't! Act! Like! That! (Mostly.)
I used to fault my manager for taking off early (in ad world read: ON TIME) to pick up her kids from daycare (the HORROR!!!).
Ugh, to say the least this piece really hit home with me.
Marketing is inherently dehumanizing: the very act of trying to understand the target audience sets up an us/them dynamic, particularly when the traits and characteristics of the said audience are seen only as channels through which to drive sales messaging. And when the target audience is “moms”, already an undervalued demographic in our culture, it's just going to get more insulting and demoralizing for all of us. I really think in addition to blogging with integrity, we need to shop with integrity – our consumer habits will be the only message advertisers ever receive. Heaven knows they won't read our blogs!
Excellent.
I too sat on the other side of the focus group mirrors in my pointy heels (it was the early 00s – damn you Sex in the City) and sharp suits resenting the all-powerful moms and rolling my eyes at the boys who worked in advertising and PR. You bring back memories of stale pretzels and M&Ms.
In my experience, most of the big consumer companies (ie the holders of the purse strings) actually respect the purchasing power of mothers – it's the hipper-than-thou marketing services companies (ad and PR agencies) that treat them as a joke.
As you said in your response, oftentimes the “mommies” writing the blogs are the same people who approve the ads. And we're watching.
Well observed and written. And yes, the professionalism needs to go both ways.
Miguelina, couldn't agree more. I was always surprised each time I discovered that plenty of ad creatives don't write for their client's audience, they write for each other.
I do not at all believe that focus groups should be the arbiter of good or effective advertising, but I do believe they offer learning that most ad folks easily dismiss.
Saw Sonic Youth in Oakland last night and read your post first thing this morning.. 2 superstar ass-kicking moms in 8 hours – My head is gonna explode!
Try being a single mom(figuratively of course)
The consideration we get in the ad, PR, blog and professional world is when we are scraped off shoes.
Excellent writing here. You know it's good when your heart starts racing a bit and you start making comments aloud when no one else is in the room.
In situations like this, with ignorance and arrogance like his, I like to remind myself that I am doing the most important job in the world – creating two amazing human beings that I am lucky to be around. What's he going to have to show for it when it all comes to an end? Some slick copy and a few good numbers? If people don't respect my CAREER as a mother, I just have to feel sorry for them. I'm the lucky one.
“Mama's got the magic… Mama's got the magic of Clorox 2!” That's about when I definitively gave up ever looking for any realistic and nonsexist representation of motherhood/parenthood/family life from the advertising world. Sorry.
Liz, I think you may need to to change your URL from Mom-101 to Mom-to-the-Mommybloggers. You're like a mama bear, making us all behave nicely and defending us from the lions.
Perhaps I've chosen the right agencies and lucked into the best clients, but I've found most of my colleagues and brand teams fall over themselves to get my opinion on marketing to moms, reaching out via social media, the works.
Could it be because I work in down-to-earth CPG-central Chicago instead of NYC?
I am a mom, a marketer and a writer. I am not a blogger. I started reading this blog for funny NY mom stories about cute kids — light, entertaining reading. I am not really interested in all this behind the scenes mommyblog politics stuff. Just for the record…
Anonymous,
I don't take requests on my blog.
But I do write professionally for those who often dictate the topic.
If you'd like to paypal my day rate to me, I'd be happy to work on a topic of your choosing. Email me, we'll work something out.
That guy's comment made me want to throw a glass of Pinot at him. Thanks for handling it far more professionally than I would have.
I used to target my kind when I was in PR, too. It is weird to suddenly become the audience.
That said, I get that we're a segment. I was happy to see Ford actually show us the six segments they have for parent bloggers. SIX! At first I was weirded out, but then I was thankful to not be shoved into one big pile.
Ok, I know you said to handle this professionally, and you clearly did – but seriously, the guy Craig who commented there? Idiot. Just an idiot would feel entitled to make a generalization about a category of people he clearly has no clue about. Because intelligent people know that it's really better to have the correct information before you talk about something (or someone.)
I won't say anymore because a comment from a completely ignorant person assuming I am just as ignorant makes me too mad.
My chief frustration is the perception that this is exclusively a Little Hobby for the Little Woman. It's so dismissive, and even if the marketing/PR people claim they are aware that Moms are More than Breeders, the truth is, few actually walk the walk beyond talking the talk.
I'm referring to repeated incidents of people wanting to capitalize on mom blogger's influence and time by asking us to promote them (their product, service, etc.)…and we're supposed to be honored by this favor (but not compensated).
Two highly unprofessional words: Bite. Me.
I've worked as a professional (writer, editor, copywriter, marketer, PR, etc.) for nearly 20 years. Until now? I've NEVER EVER met people who didn't understand business is business and requires compensation.
I have a fee schedule and pre-written response to inquiries.
*I* haven't lost sight of the fact that this is a business deal.
Too bad I keep getting annoyed by the business-end folks who have.
(Had to delete and repost for typos, argh)
I'd totally call him out for being unprofessional, but then again he's selling products that are completely incompatible with my lifestyle already.
So I'll just continue with my life of mediocrity.
Cuz, ya know, I'm too dumb to get a real job.
(texted from my iPhone poolside at the Tennis Club)
If we rant, we're considered shrill, hysterical.
If we're silent, we're dismissed.
I say rant, but do it without typos or emoticons.
Most of the mom bloggers I know started writing for themselves — a sort of transparent diary. It's easy to get swept up in the swag and advertisements, etc. But isn't that really a small elite group of mom bloggers?
I don't think we can classify the moms who just focus on reviews and giveaways in the same group as moms who only write about their lives.
I think one of the things that made mom bloggers explode (originally) was that moms are more than “just moms.” They have talents and careers and opinions and problems and sadness and interests to share OUTSIDE of being a mom. That's what attracted readership in the beginning in my opinion. Wasn't one of the first mom blogger's blog all about bucking the mom image?
And, what about the other bloggers who do giveaways and reviews, but don't happen to be “moms”? Not all women bloggers are moms. And, are they being held to the same standards?
Maybe this whole thing comes down to definitions.
Is part of the problem that you can't really lump all mothers together and think that a single type of campaign is going to work for all of us?
That must be incredibly frustrating if you are trying to market a big brand and really want to reach everyone. Maybe it is easier to dismiss mothers than to grapple with the reality that we're a big, complex market.
I also wonder what sort of blogs these sort of people see. If they only see the “big” blogs, they are only getting a small part of what's going on in blogs written by parents. If they really want to try to understand the dynamic in real families, they should spend some time browsing the small blogs, too. They should spend less time looking for the people to pitch to and more time looking for the stories that might tell them what needs their brands can meet in various types of families.
If I were at Campbell's, I'd be sitting up and taking notice. It seems that their adman isn't trying very hard to understand his market. That can't be good.
How very Mad Men of that creep who posted the dismissive comment about the very audience he's trying to reach through his ad work.
The laugh's on him, though. See, there's this fancy-shmancy term 'disintermediation,' and it's been wreaking havoc throughout the old media world. In cutting out the middle-man, or disintermediating, it means people who produce content can go directly to their audiences. TV, via Hulu, can offer programs online to fans of the show–so far, it's free. (Network tv is kinda making itself obsolete by doing this.)
The same also may be true of corporations–they can take their brands and products directly to consumers–*without* a layer of tv/print ads who are aimed at a diffuse mass audience, lack measurable impact, and are hit-or-miss when aimed at niche audiences. And companies can do this without having to pay ad agencies. Besides, with tv viewership both splintered and declining, and magazine sales weak, ad buys may not be the dominant way companies reach their consumers for much longer.
So perhaps the dismissivenes comes from a man who sees his choice middle-man spot in the ecosystem changing. He isn't king of the heap any more brokering consumers to companies and vice versa. He's just another player, and the woman with the purse strings, the voice, and the platform can be a player too–if we choose to.
I read the Ad Age comments and the article, too, and I am so happy that you are writing this post because I think you do such an excellent job of summarizing what's wrong.
I am a feminist scholar, and I studied rhetorics and ideologies of motherhood long before I had kids, and there's something humbling about revisiting my work now that I am on the other side.
Erm, that should read “tv/print ads which are aimed at a diffuse mass audience”
and not “who.”
I do so know how to write. Usually.
All the comments from “friends” of Lindsay did on that post was point out the obvious:
The author had written an entire piece based on a completely misinterpreted quote.
So really, the piece was null and void.
And the comments were sexist. I just don't think folks would be saying “Oh look, here come all 'her' friends out to defend her” if Lindsay had been a dude and her work colleagues had come over to defend her.
Of course, they'd probably just go right to the top and virtually kick him in the balls.
Either way, it's beyond insulting.
Oh yeah, and one of the comments I found really insulting was the one who said mommy bloggers were about “sharing meatloaf recipes.”
Um, I don't even know how to make meatloaf let alone have my own recipe for it. What year is it?
Kerrie, I agree, totally stupid generalization. But then, is there anything all that wrong with it?
Martha Stewart and Ruth Reichl and Bobby Flay and Mario Batali have made pretty darn nice careers for themselves sharing recipes.
Hallelujah, Mom-101! With great admiration from a mother whose office sits eerily close to Madison Avenue.
Today i came across a post by “PunditMom”, about how people judge whether moms are capable of being political or not. I loved PM's post…..then icame across yours……totally agree with you and you have put it in such a realistic way,i myself couldn't have expressed… i totally agree that motherhood doesn't diminish a woman's intellect…. along with that what really bugs me is why should we categorize mothers as political, economic,soccer mom, working mom, stay -at-home mom and the list goes on……… why can't we just accept the fact that we are mothers, each and everyone with our own piece of mind, a mind which has a power to think thus we have a power to express our opinions regarding various issues….. plain and simple……. Diaper changing and PTAs doesn't clog our brains…..our intellect comes from our heritage,education and motherhood…….yes… motherhood empowers us and enriches our mind in a different way that we didn't know existed before.
So people, please stop this categorization of mothers….. and just accept us as mothers or better yet women with brains and opinion. http://masalabowl.blogspot.com/
I have no words for some of those comments. I am just speechless and it's not because I'm busy watching “Junior”.
I am sick, sick, sick of being lumped into a category simply because I have a child. I did not push my brain out through my vagina. How many more years do we have to wait before equal rights actually becomes equal respect?
Well, I know what I'm going to do. I'm going to raise my little “Junior” to know that women whether professional, moms, or even teenagers are not lesser people. Maybe that's part of the reason I became a mom, to try to change the world even if in a tiny way. And when I'm done with my mothering duties, I will return to our public schools where I will continue to fight these horrible stereotypes and help crank out intelligent, thinking, and diversity respecting citizens of the world.
What was even worse than Craig's comment is the commenter leyarsan who linked to her BlogHer round-up. As a woman, I would have hoped for better than that obnoxious post. It just goes to show that if women can't respect other women's choices, we can't ever expect men to.
-Abby
Nice and insightful post, Liz. I only wish some men would comment instead of all the mommies who clearly are reading your blog
I'd love to hear what they have to say.
Laura Sweet:
Not sure if I should feel honoured to so clearly be included as a “mommy” or nurse hurt feelings at being overlooked. If you cut me, do I not bleed motor oil and rare steaks?
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